What vehicle now ?

After taking part in the Landy Rally in my Mercedes ML Iv'e decided I need a more extreme 4x4 the Merc is great for long distance touring and a little light green lanning but in the future I want to go a little further next year I want to revisit the places I went this year.
Val d'isere off road site is a Mecca for 4x4's and the Merc could not make it to the very top without risking losing a bumper on a deep gully the Disco's and Defender's managed although even the 90s did struggle a bit.

I have the Frontera sport which is nearly as capable off road as the Defender 90 with the oversized wheels and M/T's fitted but on longer trips it's noisy and a little uncomfortable and reliability always an issue and it's not brilliant on fuel.

So people what should I go for, I have short listed the Defender 90 200dti, Discovery MK1 or 2 with a 200dti or 300dti engine fitted the Mercedes G Wagon and a Range Rover Classic diesel each have good and bad points.

The Defender is naff on road fuel economy, noise and draughty (a little like the Frontera) although I want something to offroad in I still have to get there and back and a little comfort goes a long way.

The Disco is good on road and pretty accomplished offroad but the older models do suffer badly from tin worm the fuel economy is reasonable.

The G Wagon is very basic and to be honest far too expensive for what you get although the build quality is much better than it'e Load lane rivals.

The Range Rover is now a little long in the tooth and engine or gearbox repair's could add up to more than the car's worth.

Help me someone please as I just keep going round in circles and it's doing my head in

From the options listed I would go with either Disco II or RR Classic diesel. I have always preferred the TD5 Disco personally.
If comfort is a high priority I think you will struggle in a Defender, some people like them and find the level of comfort but for me its a no no.

IMO here is a list of pro's and cons:

Defender:

Pros: Lots of off road kit available, cheap parts, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix and Cool
Cons: Expensive to buy, poor fuel economy, LR Reliability issues, uncomfortable, Roof Leaks and sluggish engine.

Discovery:

Pros: Plenty of off road kit, cheap parts, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix, roof does not leak, AUTO BOX.
Cons: Expensive to buy, slugish engine, poor approach and departure angles etc, LR Reliability issues.

RR Classic:

Pros: Lots of off road kit available, cheap parts, roof don't leak, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix and Cool AUTO BOX!
Cons: Old vehicle, poor fuel economy, LR Reliability issues most are expensive to buy.

G Wagon:

Pros: Hard as Nails, Hard as nails, 3x Lockers, Merc built and engine, hard as nails
Cons: Need a mortgage to buy, expensive off road kit and parts, shocking fuel economy, Is that heavy is creates is own gravity well.

All will be great off road but going from a Merc ML or even a Vauxhall you will notice a drop in road comfort and vehicle equipment.


I don't have a clue what the terrain is like where you have just been.
But for the money you will spend on getting a "good one" in the private sector you could get a Shogun 2.8 or 3.2, Land Cruiser 90 series or Patrol for the same money. Arguably they are as good as the LR off road, maybe not bla bla bla.
But what you can do FACT is buy any of the above get a set of all terrain tyres and a winch for the same money you would spend on a Disco II or 90 Def that is in good enough condition to spend further money on modifying.


Now that I have possibly confused you Ill go with my previous choice. Out of your shortlist I would take the Disco II TD5.
A 2004 60,000 miles, full kit, auto box, leather, full service you, want to look to spend £4500 Max, Any more than that any you'll be able to afford 2005/2006 high mile Disco 3 2.7tdv6.

Best of luck in your search.

Jason

NOTE: Buy after February or March. I looked at Last weeks auction sales prices and most 4x4's were selling £400-£500 more than in June & July due to Winter approaching.

I would also suggest the Nissan Terrano SWB, ultra reliable and good offroad, quiet and reasonably refined on it, and they are available cheaply, service parts are cheap, filter kits (oil, air, and fuel) £10 + VAT from Milners.

Terracan Jas wrote:

From the options listed I would go with either Disco II or RR Classic diesel. I have always preferred the TD5 Disco personally.
If comfort is a high priority I think you will struggle in a Defender, some people like them and find the level of comfort but for me its a no no.

IMO here is a list of pro's and cons:

Defender:

Pros: Lots of off road kit available, cheap parts, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix and Cool
Cons: Expensive to buy, poor fuel economy, LR Reliability issues, uncomfortable, Roof Leaks and sluggish engine.

Discovery:

Pros: Plenty of off road kit, cheap parts, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix, roof does not leak, AUTO BOX.
Cons: Expensive to buy, slugish engine, poor approach and departure angles etc, LR Reliability issues.

RR Classic:

Pros: Lots of off road kit available, cheap parts, roof don't leak, out of the box off road ability, simple to fix and Cool AUTO BOX!
Cons: Old vehicle, poor fuel economy, LR Reliability issues most are expensive to buy.

G Wagon:

Pros: Hard as Nails, Hard as nails, 3x Lockers, Merc built and engine, hard as nails
Cons: Need a mortgage to buy, expensive off road kit and parts, shocking fuel economy, Is that heavy is creates is own gravity well.

All will be great off road but going from a Merc ML or even a Vauxhall you will notice a drop in road comfort and vehicle equipment.


I don't have a clue what the terrain is like where you have just been.
But for the money you will spend on getting a "good one" in the private sector you could get a Shogun 2.8 or 3.2, Land Cruiser 90 series or Patrol for the same money. Arguably they are as good as the LR off road, maybe not bla bla bla.
But what you can do FACT is buy any of the above get a set of all terrain tyres and a winch for the same money you would spend on a Disco II or 90 Def that is in good enough condition to spend further money on modifying.


Now that I have possibly confused you Ill go with my previous choice. Out of your shortlist I would take the Disco II TD5.
A 2004 60,000 miles, full kit, auto box, leather, full service you, want to look to spend £4500 Max, Any more than that any you'll be able to afford 2005/2006 high mile Disco 3 2.7tdv6.

Best of luck in your search.

Jason

NOTE: Buy after February or March. I looked at Last weeks auction sales prices and most 4x4's were selling £400-£500 more than in June & July due to Winter approaching.

well in my opinion the TD5 a bit too mutgh electricity, a 300 TDi a better bet.
Although saying that we did the Landy Rally last year in our Discovery3, long days in the drivers seat (only me driving) great comfort, also mangaged Val d'isere, we also did a off road site in France surprised everbody on what it could do up and down slopes, side slopes all on road tyres, then a little bit of mud not enough right foot and



We were surprised.
We were Teddy Bears picnic and had 29 teddies in and on the car.

But at the end of the day it is YOUR choice, find one and go for it.

Quote :

LR Reliability issues most are expensive to buy.

R.e The RRC...I keep hearing this...what parts are expensive on the RRC? When compared to other vehicles?

I would not call the Terrano refned at all, esp compared to the Merc!

Have you investigated ways you could beef up your Merc? Or do you ot really want to cannibalise it at all?

rustyrhinos wrote:

Quote :

LR Reliability issues most are expensive to buy.

R.e The RRC...I keep hearing this...what parts are expensive on the RRC? When compared to other vehicles?

I would not call the Terrano refned at all, esp compared to the Merc!

Have you investigated ways you could beef up your Merc? Or do you ot really want to cannibalise it at all?

I have fitted over size A/Ts to the Merc and it's given me about 1" lift over standard, the problem is typically the plastic bumpers front and back.

On a recent trip to the off road centre in Val d'siere I managed most of the tracks but was let down on a deepish rut the LR90 in front of me struggled to get out of it and I did not want to risk losing a bumper the Disco's and 90s had a much easier time off road but on road following the Landies I was getting over 40mpg, not bad for a panzer with the gun removed.

I can lower the Merc as low as I want to go but try finding a lifting solution or stiffer springs forget it, the hill decent and 4x4 system work faultlessly, I was astounded at the gradients it would climb on the rough stuff and going down hill it just inspires confidence crawling down with no wheel slip whatsoever

Give OEC International a call.
I have had the same problem with the Terracan on the few occasions. I/OEC were going to replace the front and rear bumpers with Tubular bumpers. Stronger, far better approach and departure angles and less prone to damage.

Ere is a pic of the style:





This might cure your problem, I had one built for my Mazda pick up truck, It greatly improved the front ground clearnace and approach angle, Air bags still worked and everything!.
And It will save you £££££££ Compared to buying a seccond vehicle and modifying it. Worth a thought anyway?

Jason

If you really wanted you could get someone to make springs and shocks to fit, to your specification...might not be as expensive as you think.

Take the bumpers off and make something else then you won't have a worry. All can be achieved just depends if you want to.

40 mpg would be very nice!

Thats a hefty lookjng bumper! -i was more thinking of a basic bar instead with decent mountings and recovery points