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 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money

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chally2
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PostSubject: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Tue Feb 08, 2011 11:57 pm

I know my battery is on it's last legs so a replacement will be necessary before we head off.
I just installed an inverter which we have used on camping trips in the past but once we fell asleep for an hour, leaving the inverter on but nothing running. Any way we had the dreaded clunk the next day, but help was at hand so no worries. Not so good if your on your tod.

so the question is just should I replace the battery with a good one and don't use too much electrics without the engine running.

or

set up a decent split charge system isolating the starter battery.

I have a disco 2 so any mods aren't as easy as say a defender so a bit of thought has to go into seperate battery position, rewiring a independant loom etc. a bonus of this system is it will be good for a winch. I have thought about a small removable one.

Any thoughts welcome.
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 09, 2011 11:38 am

chally2 wrote:

set up a decent split charge system isolating the starter battery.

I have a disco 2 so any mods aren't as easy as say a defender so a bit of thought has to go into seperate battery position, rewiring a independant loom etc. a bonus of this system is it will be good for a winch. I have thought about a small removable one.
I'm in the same boat so to speak as I too want to find out more about portable winches. I like the idea of stowing it on board away from theiving Arabs - are we allowed to say that any more? Sod it, I will say it as I had my clothes bag nicked in Algeria, so if the cap fits!!! mad

If you find anything interesting chally, I'd love to know too.

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 09, 2011 6:27 pm

I can only speak regarding 2 batteries in defender or series landy where there is room enough to fit 2 starter batteries in the box under the seat.

Had 2 batteries to a marine isolator switch (mounted on seat box behind passengers legs). You could run each battery individually or both together. If individual, only the battery in use was getting charged. Plenty if people said it would never work successfully, you'll forget to switch batteries over, your batteries will run flat etc etc. Well after over 25yrs of doing it that way, never forgot, or flattened a battery. It's a darn sight cheaper than a traxide setup or similar.

Not sure how you'd set it up in a disco coz not sure where you can fit 2 batteries.
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:03 pm

The second battery should be a combined leisure/starter battery.

Split charging systems from the cheapest include

1) Wiring batteries in parallel. If one battery goes flat te other one does as well

2) Switch. Depends on people remembering to use it correctly

3) VSR will charge second battery but will not link the two batteries at will

4) Split charging system from the 30 amp type caravan type up to the 200 amp systems by people like IBS. These automatically charge both batteries, gives indication of charge, allows both batteries to be joined together, gives off audible low battery status as well

System we use? Twin Odyssey batteries, red 110 has 1700's fitted with Genysis split charger. Black 110 has twin 1500's fitted with the IBS system. I prefer the IBS set up

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 09, 2011 10:44 pm

4x4overlander wrote:

System we use? Twin Odyssey batteries, red 110 has 1700's fitted with Genysis split charger. Black 110 has twin 1500's fitted with the IBS system. I prefer the IBS set up

HTH


Brendan

I use the same Type of Battery. Odyssey works very well. i have the PC1230 version. Runs all equipments fine, from navigation equipment to fridges freezers. My truck does have a 180 amp Alternator which charges evrything up fine. Depending on your equipment and alt i would think 1x Odyssey Battery would work well.

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:58 pm

Tom Mc wrote:
chally2 wrote:

set up a decent split charge system isolating the starter battery.

I have a disco 2 so any mods aren't as easy as say a defender so a bit of thought has to go into seperate battery position, rewiring a independant loom etc. a bonus of this system is it will be good for a winch. I have thought about a small removable one.
I'm in the same boat so to speak as I too want to find out more about portable winches. I like the idea of stowing it on board away from theiving Arabs - are we allowed to say that any more? Sod it, I will say it as I had my clothes bag nicked in Algeria, so if the cap fits!!! mad

If you find anything interesting chally, I'd love to know too.

having had our 90 / 110 /rangy and 101 ambulance stuck in 8ft deep snow i have to say a decent set of batteries such as optimas come in handy aswell as a decent winch,

it is difficult to expect the depth of the snow even in derbyshire, my rangy was first in the convoy driven by a friend followed by me in a 90 then the 110 and the 101, seemed the snow was not deep untill we started digging Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:31 pm

Split cahrge is only of use if you are running lots of stuff when parked up, such as fridge, lights etc. Just the invertor should not be a problem for a good single battery.

Don't worry about the winch as this will only be used whilst the engine is running, unless you are deap in the doo doos.

So would start with one decent battery, like the Oddesy 1500, and go from there. If you do go for 2nd battery get the same Oddesy 1500, as these can do both starting and leisure.

I have fitted a VSR (Voltage Sensing Relay) on my Td5, so as the engine starts it senses the power, joins the batteries and charges both. When engine is off it will sense when the voltage has dropped a bit and seperate the batteries. Simples

Andy
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Sat Feb 12, 2011 9:04 pm

I'm currently using a Raw Components VSR kit which so far has worked well. Only got a cheap generic leisure battery as the second one but at the moment we are onyl runnign the fridge through it (best thing I ever bought - Cheers Andy Very Happy ) and it keeps it all tip top. Was easy to install the split charge (i'm not great with electrics) which was a bonus.

Eventually I do want to get some of the starter/leisure batteries rather than a normal starter and a normal leisure, so if need be I can swap them round/link them together for starting.

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Sat Feb 12, 2011 9:07 pm

Hi Chris,

Glad fridge is all good.

That is one of the advantages of the Oddesy's is that you can swap them about, where the Optima's are two different items.

Andy
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:14 am

Fit two batteries for backup, if one fails you can use the other to get you started, I believe in KISS principle.
I have a 70 amp relay, that is ign switched , with an inline 60 amp fuse . that a heavy amp cable (eg alternator size) goes from alt to second battery this parrallels the one to main battery . This charges both batteries when engine is running .
Then I have a manual battery isolator switch (Hella) that enable me to join batteries together to jump start or when winching . Its about 99% fail safe , unless you happen to forget to switch off the isolator say after winching , and at the same time one battery decides to collapse , or diode goes in alt . If you forget to join the batteries when you need to slef jump start it just blows the 60 amp fuse
I have usede the same system for 30 odd years without a failure . Laughing

Re winch , to be much use it needs to be a decent size (line pull rating) which you dont really wwant to be lugging about .
Most of the time you find your carrying it for the use of others , unless you are looking to really push things a shovel will solve the same sort of problems . Having said all that I have warn 8724 , never needed for self recovery !
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:00 am

I've got twin batteries on my Mitsubishi - but I haven't a clue how they are wired up. I ought to try and work it out one day.
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:58 pm

I have two batteries in the bay of my series. We also have dual batteries in the Range Rover - both vehicles have the batteries in the engine bay, which IMHO is the best place for them. I bought a split charge system, which I binned some of as I didn't like the quality of the components - I used my own wring and gauges, and just used the solenoid or whatever it's called.

I have the aux stuff - so radio, chargers, interior lights, etc, on the second battery. My main concern isn't really that one battery is not enough to power all the stuff - because it is more than powerful....I just prefer to have a spare battery on board. Also If something is left on by mistake, it is not a problem. I use 2 X Marine batteries - which many will say are no good at cranking power 1000 cranking amps...not good enough....okie dokie!

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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:15 pm

i dont have twin batteries and have never had a problem with starting the next morning.
It just comon sense really ..charge any phones or camera batteries when the vehicle is moving. turn fridge down or off at night.
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PostSubject: Re: 2nd battery/split charger necessary or waste of money   Sun Mar 20, 2011 1:28 pm

Split chargers are the better option, good split charging kits are available for under £100 and simply installed by most people with basic knowledge, and two independent batteries are a good idea, partucularly for expedition use.

My preferred choice is to adopt the marine principle, keep the engine battery for the engine and basic vehicle applications such as normal vehicle systems such as lights, then wire the vehicle ancillary systems to the second auxiliary battery. This means if your main vehicle engine battery fails you can switch batteries, you may lose your fridge or inverter, but the vehicle will still run, great if your battery fails somewhere away from civilisation.

Why stick with two batteries? many modern split charging systems will run three or four batteries, with three batteries you have another option, plug and play, with a third battery in a battery box and plugged in you can remove it and use it in camp for an inverter or camp lighting, although this option depends on your requirements and usage.
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